2.Waltham Subpoena Motion, Investigative Disclosure, and Juror-Illness Adjournment
44 linesMS. CLARKE: We'll figure that out. We're just going to need an answer on Waltham.
THE COURT: Yeah.
MR. WEINREB: So we notified --
MR. MELLIN: I'm going to step out and talk to them.
MS. PELLEGRINI: I'll go with him.
MR. WEINREB: We'll stay. Al and I will stay.
So we notified Waltham that this motion has been filed.
MS. CONRAD: "Waltham" meaning the Waltham police? There are three agencies.
MR. WEINREB: I'm sorry. We notified the Middlesex District Attorney's Office that this had been filed.
MR. CHAKRAVARTY: Yeah. And so the upshot was from the defense motion that there was a search warrant done -- a federal search warrant done for certain samples that may contain blood that -- for analysis, and the defense seized upon the fact that they don't have the results of that analysis to suggest there is something else out there.
We contacted Middlesex, Middlesex sent over the analysis report of the blood analysis, and it revealed that there was no DNA profile that could be matched. So there was no DNA profile at all in any of the samples that they took, and so that there's no new information for purposes of matching to anything that might corroborate the -- either Tamerlan or Todashev's participation in the murder.
MS. CONRAD: Was a sample -- I'm sorry. Were you done?
MR. CHAKRAVARTY: In terms of the new information that we have, that's the new information.
MS. CONRAD: So there are two aspects to this: One was in the original motion and one was in the supplemental memorandum that I filed. The government has consistently taken the position that its -- first of all, it's an ongoing investigation. So now Mr. Chakravarty says there's no new information, which suggests that it's not an ongoing investigation and, therefore, the invocation of the law enforcement privilege way back when this issue was first raised which Mr. Weinreb even said was tacking closer to the wind on this issue is perhaps not validly invoked if there is no new information.
To the extent that -- the government has also taken the position that they do not -- are not in possession of the information regarding the investigation, that the investigation is being run solely by state officials, whether they be in the DA's office, in the state police or in Waltham. So that's why we filed the motion for an order to those agencies to provide -- for in camera review, if necessary, that information.
And just to put it in context again, the reason, your Honor, as I understood it ruled that we could not bring out evidence of the Waltham murders and Tamerlan's involvement is because we didn't have sufficient evidence to meet a threshold to show that he was involved. The government is taking the position that whatever information exists is in the possession, custody and control of state actors and they don't have access to it, so the logical next step is for us to find out what information exists within the hands of the state actors.
We used the example of the search warrant to indicate that a federal search warrant was used to obtain these samples and something like the results of that might be relevant. There's also other indications that the FBI has been involved in this investigation including the fact that in a 302 disclosed last week regarding Matanov, he was questioned at length, and that was the supplemental memorandum, regarding the Waltham murders and his knowledge of the Waltham murders and his knowledge of Todashev who was apparently his roommate at the time.
So there are two prongs to this: The first is really just simply we would like a court order to produce whatever state agency information exists for in camera review and to disclose under whatever protective order is necessary information indicating that Tamerlan Tsarnaev was, in fact, a participant in those murders. Just as example, the Matanov 302 asks about money wired over to Russia in the aftermath of the murders, quote, in the amount of the proceeds of the robbery.
Well, it's never been publicly reported, to my knowledge, that there was a robbery. This indicates that the FBI was aware of the amount of money that was sent over. I think the clear implication is that the -- that Matanov got the money from either Tamerlan or Todashev -- the implication is Tamerlan because they talk about him not sending money over when Tamerlan is in Russia. So it seems like the government has additional information. So that's the second prong.
The first part is we would like a court order to the state agencies. The second part is -- if there's no information, there is no information. End of story.
The second part is we would like the government to produce for in camera review any information it now has, as opposed to the information it had a year and some months ago, regarding Tamerlan's involvement for in camera review because to say we haven't met a burden without us having access to the information that would permit us to meet that burden it seems to me would be fundamentally unfair.
MR. WEINREB: So to the extent that the federal government has any information relating to Tamerlan Tsarnaev's potential involvement in the Waltham triple homicide, we have reviewed it and have produced to the defense everything that in our judgment is either favorable material evidence or material to the preparation of the defense. There would be nothing for us to give the Court for in camera review that I know of. Everything that we have, which is basically nothing, has been turned over to the defense or has already been turned over to the Court for in camera review.
It does, in fact, however, remain the case that the Middlesex District Attorney's Office is conducting its own investigation into the triple homicide, as it has been ever since the homicide occurred, and that they have steadfastly maintained that that needs to be kept confidential and they have not shared their file with us despite requests.
I think they have been concerned, not without reason, that anything that is revealed to us in the course of this case could easily wind up in the hands of defense attorneys who may have, you know, involvement with people who they believe may be implicated in the case or without the defense's knowledge, maybe even without the Middlesex District Attorney's knowledge and they simply have deemed it inconsistent with the goals of their investigation to share it with us and, therefore, have declined to do so.
So that much we agree with the defense, that what's in their files, we don't know, but what's in our files, we do know, and we believe we have handled it appropriately.
THE COURT: So you're not going to file a written response to the motions, then? I mean, that's --
MR. WEINREB: No, I think we should. I think we should and we'll do that over this -- if there's a break here, we'll do it over the break.
THE COURT: Okay. I guess --
MR. WEINREB: So we'll see what the FBI says --
THE COURT: See what the answer is.
MR. WEINREB: -- and come back.
MS. CLARKE: One other issue --
THE COURT: Let me put my thumb on the scale. I think that's the preferred solution.
MR. WEINREB: Is to wait until Monday?
THE COURT: Yeah, rather than disrupt the jury. And my concern is the integrity of the case.
MR. WEINREB: No, I understand.
THE COURT: And I think that is the better choice.
MS. CLARKE: Judge, I found out yesterday that the Court had denied the Elmirza motion. And I haven't been able to put my hands on that order so that we could raise whatever --
THE COURT: We'll -- if you haven't been sent -- it's under seal, so the clerk will send you a paper copy or an image or whatever. We'll make sure that happens.
MR. CHAKRAVARTY: This is the motion to compel parole?
MS. CLARKE: That was our motion. So I don't know whether the Court offered other alternatives.
THE COURT: Well, the alternative is, I think -- I don't know whether the order did it, we talked about it -- is a video hookup. We set that up once before. I'm sure we can set it up again. He's in Almaty.
MS. CLARKE: Right. We were just sort of counting the minutes down because it's not like it can be set up like that, so...
MR. CHAKRAVARTY: So if the government's involvement is going to be necessary for that; for example, if it's going to be done in a U.S. government facility, then we would need to talk about it.
MS. CLARKE: We would have to contact you. I would like to see the order.
MR. CHAKRAVARTY: Tomorrow is a holiday, apparently, in Kazakhstan. So it could be done next week.
MR. BRUCK: May 1st. That's right. Hence, the suit. It's May Day.
THE COURT: All right. Okay. So I'll be out in a little while. We'll find out, I guess, the answer. And if we have to confer further, we will.
(The proceedings adjourned at 10:10 a.m.)
P R O C E E D I N G S
COURT CLERK: All rise for the Court.
(The Court enters the courtroom at 10:27 a.m.)
COURT CLERK: Please be seated.
THE COURT: This will be brief. I just want to make a public announcement that one of our jurors has a temporary illness which makes it inadvisable for the juror to participate today, and so we're going to suspend the trial for today and resume on the regular schedule on Monday when we expect that the temporary illness will have passed.
That's it. We'll be in recess.
COURT CLERK: All rise for the Court. The Court will be in recess.
(The Court exits the courtroom and the proceedings adjourned at 10:28 a.m.)